On this episode, Pastor Plek, Machine Gun Nick, cand Catie Sas navigate the legislative wisdom of Exodus, dissecting a pyramid of principles from human dignity to the handling of wickedness. This isn't just a history lesson; it's a vibrant discussion that connects the dots between biblical statutes and the values that underpin family and community life today.
Got questions? Text us at 737-231-0605!
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Support the show: https://wbcc.churchcenter.com/giving
On this episode, Pastor Plek, Machine Gun Nick, cand Catie Sas navigate the legislative wisdom of Exodus, dissecting a pyramid of principles from human dignity to the handling of wickedness. This isn't just a history lesson; it's a vibrant discussion that connects the dots between biblical statutes and the values that underpin family and community life today.
Got questions? Text us at 737-231-0605!
Like, share, and subscribe! We love seeing and responding to your reviews and comments.
Support the show: https://wbcc.churchcenter.com/giving
And welcome back to Pastor Plex podcast. I'm your host, pastor Plex, and I just want to say another welcome to another than machine gun Nick, who is currently strapped, and then also we've got Mrs Katie Sass.
Speaker 3:That was such a weird thing to say. Look at his shirt. I know, but stay strapped. I don't know why I'm like. What if people think about other things?
Speaker 1:Are you saying like what's strapped means?
Speaker 3:No.
Speaker 1:I think my mind is just like it's in the gutter all the time, okay, so, yeah, all right.
Speaker 3:Well, I'm glad to have you All right so we've been talking about.
Speaker 1:I don't even know how to recover from that. Really, it's so weird. Let's pass. We've been going through Exodus and were you there for Sunday? Yes, Did you see my big like?
Speaker 3:your pyramid thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, sorry, yeah, pyramid way better thing I was wondering kind of what you thought about as I went through the book of Exodus. I tried to take the legislative portion of Exodus and break it down into its components. It kind of seems really weird. It's like you know, hey, if your ox gores you, then this is what you should do. If somebody hits a pregnant woman, then this is what you should do to them. And so I really struggled that for a long time to kind of wrap my head around what is the? What sort of order? Because I know God has got an order. This isn't random. And so what I did was I kind of built a pyramid based on like here. So slavery and murder are first, and I was like why slavery, like those seem so random? And it came down to the Mago day, the dignity. The were made in the image of God.
Speaker 3:And.
Speaker 1:I felt like, oh, okay, we're going this route, like slavery and murder affect the image of God and how you view people, right, oh yeah. And so then the next thing was, you know, don't punch your parents or curse your parents or kidnap a kid. And I was like, oh, that's family. And then the next one was like the community standards for, like, you know, if someone steals or accidentally their ox gores you, here's the fine you have to pay. And I was like, oh, this is a community standards. And then after that was like, look out for the marginalized people. Then I thought was really interesting that, hey, make sure you take care of your leaders. And then this next part was the wicked. I thought what an interesting thing that the how to deal with wicked people first don't be a wicked person, but if a wicked person has, like, their ox fall into a hole, you have to help them out, which I thought that was interesting.
Speaker 3:It's super random to me. But I mean I guess it goes down to like animals, like care for animals.
Speaker 1:No, no, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's the wicked part you treat the wicked person with grace, which I thought was wild.
Speaker 3:But what's with the? What's with the bull? What is it called again the ox.
Speaker 2:The ox would have been like their truck.
Speaker 1:So the ox falls into a hole and you don't like that person because they you know they're a dirt bag.
Speaker 3:Okay, so the person you don't like is the ox.
Speaker 1:No, no, no. The person you don't like is the person you don't like. They own an ox.
Speaker 3:Oh, they own an ox.
Speaker 1:Pretend the ox is an F-150. All right, the ox is a pickup truck.
Speaker 3:Yeah, okay, so the person you don't like owns a pickup truck, uh-huh.
Speaker 1:And then they get their pickup truck stuck in the mud. Okay, you are required to go and help them get it out of the mud. Okay so the ox is just an accessory at the verse. Yeah, it's like a possession that they have, that got stuck and they really need it and you're helping them get this possession because they care about this possession, or because that's vital to their life right Right. Like the F-150, gets you where it's going.
Speaker 2:The ox carries things to where it's got to go.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm just being generous to Ford people because I personally own a Chevy, but not a big deal. But uh, anyways, that makes sense.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it does now that I had, okay, and then then I was like what, what does the ox have to do with it?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yes.
Speaker 3:Like what? Like we love animals or something. Yeah, no, it's not.
Speaker 1:I mean I do think that's true. Okay, and then the number on top of all that was remembering the covenant. There was three times a year that everybody had to head back to Jerusalem and worship God and have a big party, and I think what was really beautiful about that just like in in how we do today, like Thanksgiving and Christmas is where the whole family gets together and so you have to be able to have function civilly with your family, and these are people within the covenant, so it's like a big church service where all the little mini church plants all over the place all come back together for one big, awesome worship service, which I think we should do. That That'd be cool. Yeah, all right.
Speaker 1:So that's where we went and really we talked about, like, I for an eye, tooth for a tooth. That's that was how they prevented revenge. You weren't allowed to take more than a tooth. Someone took a tooth from you. You weren't allowed to take more than an eye if someone took an eye from you. And really, where we got that understanding that most people desire revenge is from Genesis four, where a lamech offers up a sweet little poem to his two wives letting him know that he killed a man for hurting him.
Speaker 1:And he's like yeah, let people know. If Cain's revenge was seven times, lamex, revenge is 77 times. And so the heart is, and I've seen it with my children, I've seen it with people, probably in my own heart of hearts I've been like I will kill you. You know, like you've had moments where we've all gotten frustrated by someone doing something else and we're going to like oh, you did that to me, we're going to prison rules and I'm doing something back to you 10 times. Right, have you ever had that happen to you? Machine gun, like where someone offended you, hurt, you did something and you're like oh, it's all, yeah, a lot.
Speaker 2:I mean I could, we could tell yes, like they um, yeah, give me one story. So this is weird, because the army and all this infinite wisdom put this country corn fed boy in the barracks room with this kid from New Orleans who thought he was like ghetto or or gangster or something like, but he's definitely not gangster but he's definitely not gangster.
Speaker 2:And uh, he, he, his thing was he'd get drunk or higher, both every night, and then come home around two o'clock two am in the morning and want to Blair to talk, Right. So eventually I get in my head. I'm like, okay, I am uh the same rank as this guy because he's been busted down so many times. Uh, he can't, he can't, like hold a position in the army because he's all messed up. So I start turning it off. Well, one night he comes in there and he's like I don't know, listen to my music and if you turn it off, I'm going to, you know, blanky, blank, you know, beat you up. Basically is what he's trying to say. And so then I'm like, okay, and I turn it off and I jump on him and I beat him Like I've just fist the cuffs to his face. Um, yeah, what's? What's even more hilarious than this? So like there was a standing order that if you beat up somebody in your own platoon, like the I just did, you get an article 15. Right, so I'm like waiting for you oh.
Speaker 2:I'm sorry, that's not uh you get in trouble.
Speaker 1:It's like detention.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:But like they take no, they take away your rank or pay and rank and all kinds of stuff. Yeah, and you might have to go spend some time like in a like an army jail, just for a little bit.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:We only did that like once or twice it was worse than school detention.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 1:I would have done.
Speaker 2:I would have done a lot of ex. They called it extra duty, which means I would have worked after work beautifying the area, so cleaning stuff up, and but anyways, uh, I learned 20 years later that every NCO in the platoon wished that they could have got the lumps in on Cantrell and that's. They couldn't tell me good job drumming, but they couldn't, so so we couldn't talk about it. It was like one of those things that here's the rug. So yeah, so definitely. He, uh, you know he threatened me and I was like bet.
Speaker 1:All right, wow, cap, okay, uh, all right. So, uh what?
Speaker 3:I just don't even know what to think about.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's why you have machine gun. Nick, don't know what to think.
Speaker 3:All right.
Speaker 2:So, machine gun. It is a different world. It is a different world.
Speaker 1:So you brought the hammer on someone and so that, and so now in your new, your new creation, brand new following Jesus, now you don't look for revenge, Uh, and then the Lord called his own people within the covenant for retribution. You are allowed to look within the covenant for retribution, but then Jesus takes it and I think what a lot of people do? They want retribution from every like, every day. People should treat me the way I expect to. I treat them like we sort of have that viewpoint, and when they don't, and they don't like, oh my bad, we get super fined. At one time I was I'll never forget this I was going to mighty fine and I was trying, I was thinking about who I was going to meet and I just wasn't thinking and, um, uh, the guy holds the door for me and I just walk in and I go, I got kind of gave him like a one of those, and then he goes you're welcome, I'm like, and I was like, oh, that kind of means.
Speaker 1:thank you, like when you do the nod right, I know, but I and I was, and I just kind of was like I don't know, but he went off, do you not know? You've never been like. And I was like whoa, uh, you know, I'm just like, you know, I just was like who's having a bad day?
Speaker 1:Yeah, he was having a bad day. I wasn't ready to have a conversation at that moment and I was like, oh sorry man, and he's like, and he just kind of walked off. And I think that's how a lot of us are towards, I think, people in general. We're expecting our level of retro, or how we retrieve people, to come back to us and when it doesn't like, when people don't follow the golden rule, we want to slam them. And what Jesus teaches in uh Matthew five if someone who is an evil person slaps you on the one cheek, give them the other one. If someone sues you who's an evil person, give them. If they ask for your tunic, give them your cloak as well. Like that's going way above and beyond.
Speaker 3:If someone sues you or someone uh force you to go one mile, go with them too which is all that, so I think, but does that mean that God is telling us to be a doormat? So because, that's kind of what those verses sound like.
Speaker 2:That's exactly how I took it. Growing up, too, was there's no way.
Speaker 3:Oh, just let people walk all over you.
Speaker 2:I was like no, no, no, we're going to go for an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth.
Speaker 3:That was, you know Well. So I'm just trying to figure out like, what exactly does that mean? Because it sounds. It sounds like we just need to become a doormat to those who are evil, so that if they sue us, we just bow down and allow it to happen and give them even more.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 3:And like what? Because maybe culturally that that's what that looks like is you're just passive, you're being a doormat and you're letting people but like spiritually. What does? What is he saying Like what is God saying I?
Speaker 1:think there's part of it where we want to qualify Jesus. We want to be like now listen, jesus clearly don't understand how lawsuits work. No, I think he does know how lawsuits work. He knows how inconvenient it is. He knows what it's going to cost you. The thing is, what he's saying is like do you trust me and the me being me, jesus being in charge of the kingdom? Do you trust me more than your ability to fight somebody in court?
Speaker 3:Are we saying? Is he saying, do this so that you might win them over? Because are we trying to win them over Jesus?
Speaker 1:We're always trying to win people over, but I think his attitude is like be gracious as opposed.
Speaker 3:I think like where's the balance between being gracious and being a doormat? Like where?
Speaker 1:like so, if you never see somebody. Like if somebody is not in your community, like that's why it's an evil person, like how do you deal with the Joker? I don't know, I'm just thinking of an evil person and it's like if they want something, just give it to them and you're like what? That doesn't seem right, but this is where you've got to. Let God be the one who avenges, okay, and I okay. So let's go back to the situation that I experienced. A friend of mine, real close friend, kind of goes behind my back six figure like going behind my back like a lot of money, and we're still friends this day. I let it go, not a big deal. You know what I never had? The six figures never actually came to me, so I don't never missed it. That's probably why it's a little bit more helpful. But that now Adrian's like that six figures would definitely be really helpful.
Speaker 3:What is? What are you talking about? Like he. Like he got a position that you were supposed to be in.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so he, he, we had his financial deal. He went behind my back, redid the terms without me at my knowledge, and then I went from should have been receiving 200,000 more than I did, and he took that to him. He made it, so he got that 200,000.
Speaker 3:Sounds like a nasty friend.
Speaker 1:Oh brutal. But I don't think he knew any better. I think in his heart he's like oh, that's not a big deal, chris won't miss that. You know, I think that's kind of what he was thinking. It's wild, right, so it's wild.
Speaker 1:I don't know, I don't, I don't know, I don't know, I've shared the gospel with him many times and he's like oh, that's just not my thing. And I think kind of the whole point was like you know, when I share the gospel with you and I also I'm telling you that like God loves you and more than that like he's going to provide.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 1:And this is where I said it. So that is like and I haven't missed that 200 grand to which Joel, I think was in the back with Adrian, is like have you missed that 200 grand? It was pretty funny because he has something, Adrian, yeah.
Speaker 3:And if I would, I would be like yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but like you got like, honestly like. So I mean, god gifted our church a $1.8 million piece of property, right, that's wild yeah.
Speaker 1:And if I could have bought a $1.8 million piece of property with $200,000, I would do it in a second, and I think that's sort of like. So when I look at the blessings that have come over and over, the Lord has provided, I think what you're doing is you're not trusting in your ability to make things right. And this isn't me. I'm not like thumbs down on lawyers. I don't want anyone to kind of kind of take that mindset. The point that Jesus is making is be gracious with evil people who don't?
Speaker 1:who aren't of the kingdom of God.
Speaker 3:Okay, so the biggest key difference in between being gracious and being a doormat is being gracious means you're being gracious out of a trust, a deep trust in the kingdom that God will provide, that God will avenge. And then, versus being a doormat, is you're living in a mindset of defeat.
Speaker 2:Like there's no trust. You're just like laying down.
Speaker 3:You're just going. Oh, I guess I have to do this. I am a victim Like you're living in victim mentality because I'm trying to differentiate what you're saying what these verses are saying between like what our culture with these and what normal people like me would hear that and think, oh so just lay down and let them stomp all over me some more.
Speaker 1:Right, but it's an evil person who has evil intent and spiritually, it's being.
Speaker 3:We're not being doormats, we're being gracious because we are trusting that God will handle, and I think, but I feel like.
Speaker 1:This is the part where what I want you to see is that what the people, what the Jews of that day, were saying, because let's just, maybe this will help. This will help set it up. Jesus is doing the Sermon on the Mount. He's talking to primarily Jewish people who are oppressed by Romans. Okay, that's the context.
Speaker 1:All these Roman people are oppressing me, okay, and what he's saying is when an evil person oppresses you, go with it, meaning, don't try and be like. That's not fair. Don't try and hold the Roman oppressing person to the standard of the law that I've never read, never heard about, and thinks completely stupid. So be generous with them and when they ask you for the tunic, give them the cloak as well. And then this is where God says that even the you know look at the birds of the field and you know, even not even Solomon, all of his glory, was closed as one of these are the you know flowers of the field. And does that make sense? So it's like you're. Don't expect people who are not of God, those who are the evil of the evil one they are, of course are going to treat you poorly.
Speaker 1:And if you try and battle that in your own strength, in your own power, you are always going to walk away hurt and defeated because that's. Those people are not of God. Those people are who's. God is going to pay them back a bazillion fold.
Speaker 2:Like I think.
Speaker 1:That's where we don't. That's why hell is such a real thing. Okay, not why, but hell is such a real thing. And so, therefore, when people wrong you and they're not followers of Christ, then it's not that we walk away going Mwah ha ha, you're going to get yours, but we can. We know that God is God of justice and he's going to make sure that justice is served and he's always going to take care of his children.
Speaker 3:So there's a lightheartedness in being gracious because we know that, like God is, god's got it.
Speaker 1:You know, this is where, in James one, you'll consider pure joy.
Speaker 1:My brother is one of your face trials of many kinds, because you know the test of your faith, the fellow's perseverance, and no one's sitting there going like yay, but what Jesus is saying here is you have an opportunity to be gracious with people who are far from God, and it's such a flip it on its head type mentality. It's wild. And listen, this is I have not arrived. I was able to do that in that one circumstance because I had been sharing the gospel with this person for so long and was like crud. This is the very thing that I want to make a big deal about, but I can't. I mean I, you know I can't.
Speaker 3:It's like God has already given you what you need.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was like clear as day for me the right thing to do. It was like it wasn't even.
Speaker 3:And you didn't want to function out of greed.
Speaker 1:Right, I mean, trust me, the greed was there, but I was like I had to go through it. Do I believe God has way more for me than trying to battle this thing in court with one of my closest friends in entire life?
Speaker 2:Well, I mean, that's good on a personal, day-to-day level, but this is America, right? America are the land where we got taxation without representation. We went and stole your cannons and then used them on you. So, talking, you know, as a country, as a nation, as a people, like are we expected to let a tyrant government just step all over us?
Speaker 1:So now you're getting into something completely different of government. So, remember, the power of the sword is given to the king or given to the government. Okay, and so this is the big question, then, and I don't want to go down this rabbit hole too far.
Speaker 1:But I think it's a good question. What just war theory? When is it okay to rebel against tyranny? Yes, when is it? When is my active use of force blessed by the Lord, so that I'm not acting out of sin? So there's a couple of things. One, I'm not acting on my own, like I'm not getting revenge for me. I'm looking to serve another person.
Speaker 1:So in the concept of like, say, you create a government to kind of go against another government and have the power of the sword. Well, that's, it is challenging to figure that out. I think that for me, like the American revolution, is one of the hardest things to wrap my head around, because what made them a legit government and that they could now go and rebel against the king, who was an evil king? Clearly Nero was an evil king, but you didn't see the Christians rising up and saying no more persecution. But then and then, ultimately, that persecution was which led to taking over the whole empire. So it's not as clear cut as anyone Now do.
Speaker 1:I think that the Revolution and war had grounds for fighting Britain? I think they did, but they had to first become their own government. And I think that that's complicated in and of itself, because if in Romans 13, the power of the sword is given to a ruler, well then they formed their own government. And now we're, we're representing these people and we're battling you because we want freedom and we want independence as a nation. I think that's God ordained.
Speaker 1:But at that time John Wesley, who was a big Christian British guy, and George Whitfield, big Christian British guy who did ministry in the US or the Americas, the colonies back then, was very against that and they thought it was like utter rebellion, but then obviously their churches flourished here, um, kind of wild really, yeah, sorry, uh, okay. So so let's, let's get off the just war theory for a moment. I do think it's a great direction to go. Here's a question you talked about how we were to go confront those who have sinned and forgiven. What about the flip side of that? If we're the ones who sinned towards someone, are we not called to go confess to them and ask for forgiveness?
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah In fact, I think I talked about that the week before. Um, uh, that's when we went through yeah, I think that was the week before. Uh, we went through, yeah, if you strike a man, blah, blah, blah, death penalty. We talked about the death penalty. Um, we say like, remember, we said not murdering is good, reconciliation is better.
Speaker 3:And then it's when you talked about, like, when you bring, like they brought the bull to the altar and then they had to go, they had to leave the bull or whatever their sacrifice, and then go and reconcile, and then they could come and like do their sacrifice or whatever.
Speaker 1:Right, maybe it was actually on the 14. No, it was a week before.
Speaker 3:Um, maybe, yeah, I think it's like like if we have it reconciled with who we've hurt, then sacrificing or bringing anything to God is going to feel empty. And yeah, the big thing was if you.
Speaker 1:If you remember someone had someone has something against you leave your gift at the altar go and be reconciled so yeah, so I think that was the week before or that was a couple of weeks.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think it was on, it wasn't it was. It was. It was last week or was it the week before. Anyways, yeah, it was a week before.
Speaker 1:Now, now I'm yeah, it's funny how it all runs together for a while, yeah, we've been in an exit, like I.
Speaker 3:When you said we've been an exodus since since Moses wrote it, I was like I feel that, yeah, that's true. And you said we're going through the entire book.
Speaker 1:We are going through the entire book.
Speaker 3:So when are we going to finish like next? No, I think next Christmas.
Speaker 1:I'm talking to the elders about it actually, and, um, I think they're all telling you to pause, it right, no, they're. They might be telling me just to keep pressing, but I am going to advocate for be done by Easter.
Speaker 3:Can you just like skip some chapters?
Speaker 1:We are going to skip some chapters a little bit, but we're summarizing some of them. No, no, we can. Are you? Are you enjoying going through it there? Yeah, See, he likes going through it first five hours.
Speaker 2:Are you like?
Speaker 3:I'm not hating on the book, like I'm not hating on the book of exodus. I think, the book of exodus has a lot of really great chunks and and we learn a lot from the book of exodus. But, like my attention span, when we've been going through something for like months, it's the same book, but it's always the same characters for months. No, it's not. Yeah, the book of exodus is the longest stuff in it Same topics, for it's of an entire. Actually, Leviticus is probably pretty similar.
Speaker 2:You can't apply the first five books of the Bible.
Speaker 3:Well, Genesis is pretty exciting. Got a lot of stuff in it, Yep. But then exodus, Deuteronomy, numbers, Leviticus I didn't say them in order, but it's fine, those are all once. You just got to get through those.
Speaker 2:No, I don't think so, because I agree, we are going through like how to forgive people right now and maybe that's not a big deal for you, but that is huge.
Speaker 3:You know where else the book talks about forgiveness.
Speaker 1:Where.
Speaker 3:In the New Testament too.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's where I went to. You start from exodus and then you show where Jesus comments on exodus.
Speaker 3:I'm just saying it's been a long time, but it resonates everybody differently.
Speaker 2:I know machine gun.
Speaker 3:Nick, I'm aware that it resonates with people?
Speaker 2:Do I just have this ability on women? Is this just me?
Speaker 3:It is Okay great.
Speaker 2:I just went through this. I'm not.
Speaker 3:I literally just said. I'm not hating on the book of exodus. I'm just saying it's freaking long and my brain is ready for something new.
Speaker 1:Okay, all right.
Speaker 3:Okay, that's all I'm saying. That's all she's saying. Can we not, like accuse me?
Speaker 2:of being some sort of like caterer, I'm just saying it's been forever. I take it back if I offended you and I apologize. Oh my gosh, I did not try to make you feel offended. That was really good machine gun, nick. We're working on things right now.
Speaker 1:That was really well done, congratulations. That was awesome. So how? Now talk to me. Have you been able, like in your life, to have this amount of self control?
Speaker 2:No, what happened? We had a discussion today. What happened? Oh you mean, how did we get to this point?
Speaker 3:Oh, were we supposed to tell some life story, oh yeah, all right.
Speaker 2:So the ex-wife, my son, had a bad day yesterday, got in trouble at school for the first time and was rude to his, to a teacher person, and then gets like completely what we used to call in school suspension. So we got put in a room all day for the rest of the day. Couldn't be with general pop, you know, solitary confinement kind of. And she was very, you know she was, she was upset about that. So I was like, okay, we talked about it earlier in the evening and then she wasn't feeling very well last night. So she calls me up because she's at this point in time. She's like well, I can't, you know how get these kids ready for school. I'm going to need help. So you know, will you come by tomorrow, just in case? And I'm like, yeah, sure, no problem.
Speaker 1:No problem Look at that.
Speaker 2:And so I go over there and we just got done having a full conversation about you know, I need to be more of a part of my kids life and I'm over here like absolutely like this is honestly something I've been praying over for myself. But I'm like, how do I get back into this? I hardly even know my son and so go over there right Execution. And he's been, he's been rude the whole morning and I kind of raised my voice. I don't consider what I did, yelling, I just raised my voice to him. And then she comes downstairs and was like, if you're going to yell, you can't be here in the mornings. And I'm like, wasn't yelling To you know, defending myself, but not to that to an extreme point, just saying, hey, that to me that wasn't yelling.
Speaker 1:Tell me what raising your voice sounds like.
Speaker 2:Hey, no, that's yelling.
Speaker 3:Okay, that like maybe I wasn't expecting you, I'm just like hey, you're being rude. It's a firm tone.
Speaker 2:Just, yeah, just a firm conversation. Okay, yeah, stop being rude. I'm your father, I will take you out of this world. No, I won't.
Speaker 1:I brought you in this world, I can take you out. Yeah, yeah, I don't know if that actually works like that. I don't think we can say that anymore.
Speaker 2:But yeah, right, but you know, no, I didn't, and I didn't go to that extent. I was just like, stop being rude. Like there's a line you're crossing it, don't do it, and you know. So she comes with this whole like you can't yell if you're going to be here in the morning or you need to leave. I'm like I'm not sure if we really need to go down that road right away. We could have had a, a calmer conversation about this, right, and maybe not in front of the lab that we're trying to now perform this unified front to, so that you know, maybe he doesn't do bad things. And so the morning continues and she has allergies or whatever. And she said like her ear popped or like I don't know whatever it was. It was like, hey, that could be an ear infection, knowing it probably isn't just making conversation.
Speaker 2:And then the condescending tone and the freaking like just the rudest way to speak to somebody comes out of her mouth and I'm like, I'm like, look, I don't want to argue, like I'm not here to argue with you. You know, I don't. I'm not apologizing for what I said, but I'm also not like I'm also not trying to escalate it either. And she, she just snaps at me with a no, I'm not and I'm. I'm being serious, like I don't think you got any of. You think I'm a sensitive person, right? I don't think I allude that to anyone. So if I'm saying that, you're being rude, like most people would probably get the crap stomp out of them If you talk to me like that, the way she's talking.
Speaker 1:So not you know, and I don't know her, but she seems like a lovely person. But it might be I'm just throwing this out there that you are sensitive because she does mean so much to you, and so I think so anytime anyone has ever told me that they're not sensitive. That's like, oh, they're super sensitive, crud. I need to really watch myself because anytime anybody has ever said that to me, I have easily offended them. I'm like, oh, they didn't really mean that. What do you mean that's like a defense mechanism?
Speaker 2:That doesn't make sense at all.
Speaker 3:I know so because if what is it like to be not sensitive?
Speaker 1:I just don't think people are. I think they're just not in tune with their emotions.
Speaker 3:Or they just think it's cool to not be sensitive or they're like low maintenance, or or you just.
Speaker 1:You know, callous yourself, and I'm not saying like you've callous yourself I. All I'm saying is it for this particular person who you were married to for 13 years, yep. It's hard to not you're gonna be sensitive, develop a sensitivity.
Speaker 1:Like take her mother of your child, your children, yeah and if you feeling disrespected in front of your kids, that makes it like eight times worse. So I think, if this is the part where to Katie's point like you've got to be really gracious with her and Because if she's not a follower of Jesus, then Ultimately you're gonna have to just love her where she's at. And it I get. It it's hard, I get it.
Speaker 1:I did yourself, died yourself every moment and I think sometimes we're afraid that our kids are. They just see that and they go oh, that's how they're gonna treat me to, or?
Speaker 3:something like that well, and then like, if you're, if you're being gracious towards her and dying to yourself in front of your son, then that Speaks volume more than it does, you demonstrating dominance and there you go to your point on being a doormat, versus Because isn't?
Speaker 1:that true of the whole world when they see someone Villain, like when someone steps into the villain world and you sort of take it.
Speaker 3:But with confidence, but with confidence.
Speaker 1:Yes, it's wild. So one of my favorite stories of Charles Stanley, who was a pastor in Atlanta, like he had this one guy at his church who Didn't like him and back in the 70s they were voting on for him to be the pastor of the church and the guy got so angry and Charles very calmly went up to him, say, hey, we need to calm down. And the guy just punched him, slugged him and and then that made him leading the church super easy. Okay, there's one time I use this to my advantage I'm not proud of all right ready. So is that this like singles retreat back in the day and we're playing I don't know like ultimate frisbee or something. And this guy started like Talking back and like you know, like getting real fired up and I knew that if I was really calm to him he would lose his ever-living mind and make himself look like a complete fool. I go whoa, hey man.
Speaker 1:It's so you manipulated, I did. I don't not really proud this moment, but it worked out unbelievably. My favorite. Yeah, I think this is when, adrian, I started dating. So I go hey man, just calm down, it's cool.
Speaker 1:It's cool, hey, hey, nobody wants to fight here, nobody wants to fight. Oh, I'm like, hey, it's easy, and I just went, the calmer I got, the more fired up and like six people have taken away. It was like wildly successful. I know I'm terrible, but To the point, like it's. Not only is it like biblical, it works. I mean, jesus isn't giving you something that's impractical, because I think from your perspective, you become a no, no. You actually step into more authority and more power. When you confidently Like say, oh, you're suing me for my, for my tunic, you know what.
Speaker 3:You clearly need this Clearly you need it more than I do.
Speaker 1:I man, I didn't realize that you were this hard up.
Speaker 3:Well, it's because when you know you've got the kingdom of God behind you, everyone else needs something more than you do. Right, because you've got all you need exactly.
Speaker 1:So if they're gonna fight so hard over something like this, then clearly they need it More than you do in the into the machine gun nick moment, like this morning, I think if you come back like hey, I just want it, I'm here to serve, I'm sorry if I came off like I just man, my bad, uh, what do you need for me right now? I'm ready to help. And then it's such a weird Like how do you come back from that? Well, first off you could just shut your mouth, I'm like, and then you. Then they look like a fool Because it's foolish, it's like you're and it's. The whole point is not to make a little dumb, but in heavily.
Speaker 3:when you act godly and someone's acting evil, they look foolish happens every time which just to also say it's not that you're wanting to be gracious to make your ex-wife Look foolish, you're on your wanting to be gracious to her because you want to honor her and show your sin. What honoring someone who's criticizing you looks like.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but in heavily. An evil person looks dumb when their evil is fully exposed as evil.
Speaker 3:Right, like your son wants it, not. Okay? This is not me trying to get a parent.
Speaker 1:Let's give some parent advice. Let's see what you got.
Speaker 3:I don't have a son, but I did grow up with four brothers and what I, what I have kind of developed this theory is like boys need to see their dads treat their moms with honor and respect, even when Mom is not treating them with honor and respect. Right. And so how do we? How do we respond to someone who's criticizing us, especially in front of our kids? And so that's the big question is like your nailing it.
Speaker 1:How do we?
Speaker 3:How do we teach our young sons to grow up to be men who honor and in respect and our kind and patient and understanding towards a woman when she's criticizing them right? So I don't know, I mean, I'm not a parenting expert, but that's kind of like my. I think you're right on.
Speaker 1:I think that's sort of what you're modeling, especially for your kids, in this situation.
Speaker 3:It's a hard situation and it takes it's easier said than done, obviously, because in the moment that would have been frustrating to me and I don't. I don't practice that with Ava all their time either, and, um, because I get angrier with Ava than I do. I'd never really get angry with Ryan, but I get angry with my three-year-old all the freaking time, yeah, so in the moment, of course, you're fiery.
Speaker 1:You never get angry at Ryan.
Speaker 3:No.
Speaker 1:Wow.
Speaker 3:I get my feelings hurt, but I never get angry. Yeah, no, I not say he's like perfect, yeah, like. I get my feelings hurt, so you get your feelings hurt and you don't.
Speaker 1:You don't um Go to anger. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Well you're yours shut down, I just shut down and sob. Okay, that makes sense.
Speaker 1:All right. So, uh, I can't wait for Megan to be on the show. Good luck. I think that would be an awesome game.
Speaker 3:Do you think one day you'll ever get back together?
Speaker 1:I think they will.
Speaker 3:You're a changed man.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you really, he really cares about her oh.
Speaker 3:But like think of how that would affect your kids. Oh, amazing if they saw their two parents like reconcile and and.
Speaker 1:I mean, she definitely needs their Jesus. But I think that there's that, that can happen. Are you praying for that?
Speaker 3:No.
Speaker 2:I'm praying for something to help her, but I'm not praying for us.
Speaker 1:I'm not saying praying for you guys get back. What I am saying is like praying for her um to be saved.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's. I could change my prayer lately. It's just been praying for her heart to like soften. Okay or for there to be one. That might have been too harsh. I'm sorry.
Speaker 1:Yeah, pray, pray the god, pray the gospel over here. I think that's that, that's your, I think you're like you know, lord, would you save Megan? Would you help her recognize the depth of her sin and her need of a savior? You save me so clearly you can save anybody.
Speaker 2:And then Jesus make moving our heart.
Speaker 1:I think that's because that's the mother of your kids. You want the mother of your kids to know Jesus. Oh.
Speaker 2:I definitely do. Yeah, I mean Especially with uh, my son's rude, she was rude and I'm like, looking at this like I'm seeing a pattern here. No one else is realizing this pattern and I know, if I bring it up, that we're gonna have one of those moments.
Speaker 3:Yeah, because you're never.
Speaker 1:You're pretty much the epitome of sainthood over here right, like a cousin and mother Teresa. Yeah.
Speaker 3:I know.
Speaker 2:Do you say I'm rude?
Speaker 3:I mean no but, everybody's rude sometimes.
Speaker 2:How do I come across people?
Speaker 3:You, I don't know.
Speaker 1:All right, do you really want to know? You can go ahead, Katie. I would love to hear what you think.
Speaker 3:How do you come across people? What's it?
Speaker 1:like to be on the other side of machine gun, nick.
Speaker 3:I don't think anything negative. I mean I wouldn't say you're intimidating, I would say you're kind of goofy. I guess Really You're kind of like. Some of the things you say are just like a little bit ridiculous.
Speaker 1:Yeah I'd say flip it you don't really think about anything that's coming out of your mouth. You don't really take yourself that seriously, right, which is sweet.
Speaker 3:Which I mean. Honestly, you're kind of a lot of characteristics that I have to. Yeah, yeah, that's what makes you really fun to be around.
Speaker 1:But if someone's counting on you or they need you, that would be kind of hard Right.
Speaker 3:Because you want to be someone that can also be trusted and relied on.
Speaker 2:Okay, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and. I think you're moving that direction.
Speaker 2:Well, that's good.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's. This conversation shows that you are God is giving you a softened heart to love people and love your XY.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and to the question earlier that asked about you know what about if you've offended someone? You talked about those who we are to go to confront, who have sinned and forgive them. What about the flip side of that? If we are the ones who sin towards someone, are we not called to confess the mass forgiveness? And this was the last way I finally found out yeah, this was last week. So if you're offering your gift at the altar and they remember that your brother has something against you, leave your gift there before the altar and go first be reconciled to your brother, then come in off your gift. In other words, your worship is hindered because you have an offense that you know someone is offended by you. You know, this is this verse. I'll know this was back and it's funny how, like you remember stuff, but like 2000 and not no 2007 to the.
Speaker 1:I remember the year that the church I was going to at the time is fellowship church downtown and it was like canned food drive Sunday. You know, everyone bring canned food and what you could do was buy canned food in the parking lot and then take it in. So they like. They're like, hey, you probably forgot, because who remembers? But just buy. And so this guy goes hey, do you want to buy some canned food? I'm like, no, and I was just really short with him.
Speaker 1:One and I think it was because I was embarrassed I didn't bring the canned food. I didn't have it was, I was just a turd, I don't know what it was, and as I'm worshiping the Lord, like this verse popped my head and I'm like, oh, I can't. So I walked out. Like you know, it was a big parking lot to walk, walk forever and I go finally hey, I just want to apologize for being rude to you earlier. I feel like such a dirt bag. I'm so sorry. I'll buy like three cans or whatever. And I bought the cans, I went in and I was so relieved by that. But I still remember, like that in 2007. And I still remember it like it was yesterday, of that feeling of being rude to that guy.
Speaker 3:I have apologized to people for something I did like seven years ago.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Like I'll just randomly, out of the blue, send them a text.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:And like either, they'll remember or they won't like, they'll remember and they're like oh my gosh, that means so much to me. I've like struggled with that season of life for so long and when did you like what happened?
Speaker 3:There was a girl that I lived with years ago, before Ron and I were dating, and she was struggling in her faith and I was technically, I mean, I was still pretty immature and I struggled with legalism in that season of life, and so I was like so what are you looking at me, confused for what, what, what did you see? Oh, legalism, so like hyper focused on rules and behavior modification rather than like heart change.
Speaker 1:Wow, well said Wow.
Speaker 3:Well, and so I just kind of thought, like me and me and Ryan were dating and we had gotten engaged and I held myself very like high and holy because we hadn't had sex yet and whereas, like she was dating guys and was not holding herself to that standard.
Speaker 3:And I just remember being like like I was so rude and I would say like just stop. Like why are you like? Why don't you just stop doing that? Like it's stupid, like just stop. And like no, no consideration for her feelings or anything that she was going through, because she was clearly struggling. It's not like she was just going out like and just having sex and thinking of it.
Speaker 3:Like it was heavy on her and she was like I just I'm having a hard time with my faith in God, I'm having a hard time with how, who I am as a woman and with men and all this stuff, and I just you went with the Bob Newhart, just stop it.
Speaker 3:Just stop, Like what are you? And? And so just really rude and I just wasn't kind to her like in other ways too, and but I I thought I was the victim because she'd like be mean to me sometimes too, like passively, and so the right truth, but the wrong grace.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, there was like no grace at all.
Speaker 3:And so when probably this was last year, probably, or maybe a couple of years ago I had been thinking like God, I just put it on my heart, like you need to apologize to her, like this is something that you need to reconcile. It was years ago, but that doesn't. There's no time limit, right? And so I sit her a long Facebook message and just explaining and like having to humble myself and say like I was really awful towards you and you didn't deserve that, and like How'd that go over.
Speaker 3:It meant a lot to her. Like she remembered I mean, who does it remember being treated like complete crap, you know. And so she. She was like I am so thankful that you reached out and you know, da, da, da, like yeah, you've never.
Speaker 1:No, yeah, you don't know the lasting effect of like your mistreatment towards someone.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:There's so many people I've screwed over I can think I think back to our people grade nationally more prone to like remember when someone was was negative to them or mean to them over like good stuff.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and so it's a different mindset to like to block out that stuff and think of the good times, like is there, like is that something to being in a relationship, or am I just making all this up in my head right now?
Speaker 1:Wait, what do you say?
Speaker 2:So is there something to being in a productive, healthy relationship to like letting go of the bad stuff and focusing on the good stuff?
Speaker 1:Yeah, that is healthy, but you have to process that and you, you have to. It's not an isolated process. Um, sometimes it has to be because you've lost connection or relationship with that person completely, but for the most part, the most healthy way, and that's why we talk about you know, confess your sins one to another and pray for each other that you may be healed, and that's why we do the whole confession, repentance thing around here.
Speaker 1:But, like even with I think about Megan, with you, I think you have told her hey, you were a really cruddy husband or whatever, and that was really good, and I think I think what happens, though, when you do that, you can't expect to be like finally, thank you. Oh, now I'm going to be kind to you. No, there, that's not, probably not going to be happen, and you, all you can do is own what you can and then be as loving and a human being as possible toward her, even though all the hurt that's gone both ways.
Speaker 3:Cause. Being like being healthy emotionally isn't ignoring all of the hurt you've walked through for the sake of being mature or looking like you. It doesn't phase you. It's about facing what has hurt you and reconciling it, if you can with that person, yeah.
Speaker 1:But yeah, I think and that's why I keep saying to you that with with her, I would go back and I would just be like, hey, I hurt you, and I know you've said that, but I think I don't know if she, you know some, at some point some people go oh, what's he? You know what does he want, and just, and sometimes she can go well, blah, blah, and then if you have to qualify or you make a, a flipping comment, it kind of deletes all the kindness that you just inserted right there. I don't know, I don't know if you've had that experience, but but I think that that might be where, and if your kids see that you know the most beautiful thing that I do with my kids a lot.
Speaker 1:Whenever I say something, whenever I say something rude to Adrian I'll and the kids here, I make sure I apologize in front of them to her because they need to see what that looks like and it makes them feel like, oh, that is not a complete jerk and we can't just go. Oh, that's just, dad, If you ever, ever have me and wouldn't say about you oh, that's just who they are.
Speaker 1:That's how they are, they're just you know, then, what they've done is they've treated you like a non-believer, kind of to the point of like you've treated them like a Gentile. They don't know anybody, they're complete evil, and that is like they're not worth confronting, they're not worth putting in the time and effort to restore the relationship, because they're evil to the core.
Speaker 1:That's what you're saying and I think and there's times for people that are like that. The thing that stinks about co-parenting as a divorced person is that you're never. It's like you're not ever going to be, like I'm never going to see you again. That's why divorce is so hard. And so just not practical in many ways. I'm not saying I feel like I need to qualify that. I understand there are reasons and all that, but if you can make it work, man, yeah, oh my gosh. Man.
Speaker 3:Like. I don't know if this is what I should do, but I'm for sure, praying that you and your ex might get back together.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I've already been praying that. So that's, I think you're in alignment.
Speaker 3:I'm like this, but that could be what a beautiful story of redemption for your kids to see that you fought for your family to be together.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you fought for your country.
Speaker 3:Kids, kids want to see their parents fight to keep the family together.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like that's, like, it's not. But this isn't a judgment right, we're not judging.
Speaker 3:No, my marriage is divorced and yeah.
Speaker 1:Back to I'm not sensitive.
Speaker 3:Okay, good, all right.
Speaker 2:Good, I don't feel, I don't feel like you're judging me Good, good, good. And if I? Did, I'd probably be like and I don't really care because, no, I don't. That's the way I feel like. When people are like well, this one person thinks this, I mean, I'm like, and you care why? Yeah, I don't really care what people think.
Speaker 3:But that doesn't mean that you don't have that, you're not a sensitive person. Being sensitive doesn't mean that you're like like yes, I think being sensitive can sometimes mean that you just get your feelings hurt all the time, but sensitivity as a character trait means that you have a caring heart and you feel with other people.
Speaker 1:And it makes you watch your words.
Speaker 3:Right, like you're sensitive and considerate, like, think of, like you're considerate of their feelings.
Speaker 2:That's not how I took it at all. You're going to be sensitive to.
Speaker 3:You're going to be sensitive to their emotions. You're going to be sensitive to how other people might feel or how other people might interpret.
Speaker 1:Consider others more significant than yourselves.
Speaker 3:Like sensitivity is like a good softness, yeah, whereas, like I think, socially, a lot of people have said, oh, you're being too sensitive, because they're getting their feelings hurt.
Speaker 2:Right, so it only takes sensitivity as being insensitive.
Speaker 3:Which I mean. I guess that but be.
Speaker 1:And, to be fair, that's kind of how we, when we first entered this conversation about you, know if someone slaps you on the one cheek, often the other as well, if someone sues you for your tunic, take them, take the, give them the cloak as well. So, unfortunately, you go one mile, go two. I think we've seen that as, oh, you're just a sissy, as opposed to coming from a place of strength. Think of like a toddler ordering around you you, you know a massive dude, and like they slap you on the one cheek and then insult you and you go. You wanna do it the other, because you have completely. There's nothing about you can be moved by that, because you know you can destroy them in a second, and that's how, when you're part of the kingdom of God because God is on your side.
Speaker 1:If God is for you, who can really be against you?
Speaker 3:Nobody can.
Speaker 1:And so I think we look at that as what am I about to lose in this situation? What pride am I about to lose? What monetary thing am I about to lose? What physical exertion am I about to lose as opposed to, how am I gonna honor God really well in this situation? And to that point, like, just be.
Speaker 1:And if Megan has, if her words are like not one pound words or a thousand pound words to you, it's the same way for your words back to her. So when you come off as insensitive or you're not thinking about her needs, that it hits her just as hard as it hits you because she's had so much invested in you. And when you don't realize the power your words have and I listen as one who has not realized the power my words have I've totally been that guy, probably with Katie several times, you know I didn't realize the amount of weight my words had and so therefore I just threw them out there at being funny or being whatever, and then all of a sudden it just wrecked them. I mean wrecked their life. So I think that's where, if you can consider, like where, how heavy your words are and how people look at you, and as a man of God, especially when you say something like I feel like I'm called to be a pastor. It's like it's now like an extra level of weight.
Speaker 3:Yeah, like knowing when to be sensitive towards others is a strength, and so like being sensitive and seeing through their actions. Yeah yeah, and what they're really needing in that moment. Cause.
Speaker 2:With someone who, every time I've been vulnerable, has hurt me. That's where we're going with this.
Speaker 3:Well, they're not a Christian. So you have like.
Speaker 1:When an evil one slaps you on the one cheek.
Speaker 2:You give them the other one right.
Speaker 1:And that's exactly Because because you are not a toddler, you are a big, strong man of God who's strapped apparently by your t-shirt and what that says. You put on the full armor of God every day. So you have the breastplate of righteousness, you got your helmet of salvation, you got the belt of truth, you got your feet shod with the gospel, the readiness of the prepared to the gospel. You got the shield of faith, the sword of the spirit. What does she have? She's just vulnerable to the enemy. So she's getting beaten down by Satan's minions and the enemy all over the place, and she's probably feeding her flesh the darkness. And so then, all of a sudden, you're coming there and you have the armor to have a shield of faith, extinguish the fiery darts, the enemy.
Speaker 1:And what happens when you don't do those things? You're acting like everybody else on the planet would act, because what you know? Jesus said what good if you're only good to those who love you. Don't even the tax collectors do that. But you are a child of God. Shouldn't you be loving and unbelievably gracious to those who are far from God? And eventually, those who are far from God are gonna go. Like what is wrong with you? Why are you so kind to me? I've been intentionally trying to be a jerk to you.
Speaker 3:So that's why, when she shows a lack of consideration for your vulnerability, you have to choose to not be shaken by that, because you know that she's struggling with not knowing. I mean everyone that doesn't know Jesus. They are deeply struggling, whether they know it or not, right, Did you not realize that?
Speaker 1:I'm sure you knew that but yeah, yeah. I know that. I know that in theory, but it's hard to see it in practical practice Okay.
Speaker 2:So it's very easy to see when you know we go door knocking, you run into a person right and you offer them a prayer or something Like you know, you know what you're going against, you know the enemy there. It's harder for when you have like a history with that person to put that history aside, cause basically you're saying, all right.
Speaker 3:Well, you don't put the history aside, you forgive. That's what I was going at. You forgive right. Yeah.
Speaker 2:For their Transgressions, transgressions, aeons, and then it's way harder.
Speaker 1:But what if somebody knocked on Megan's door and they shared the gospel? They're never going to get it in. Okay, right why?
Speaker 2:Because she won't like the world's, she won't open the door.
Speaker 1:Right, and I think that's where it is. Only, it's going to take a supernatural act of God for her to open the door of her heart, and that's where you're the only Christians she sees on a regular, and she's given you access inside her house. You get to be a light and so you're the only person that can go inside. This is why I do think if I knocked on a door and said, hey, would you mind if I prayed with you? I'm sure you've got some hard things going on in your life.
Speaker 1:Like your ex-husband, I could probably, you know, help you do it. If I just went out of the blue, she would think I was nuts, right, very much, okay so, but you are already inside the house. She's asking you to help discipline the kids, and if you do it in a godly way and you respond to her in a godly way, even when she responds to you in an evil way, then wow, that's power. And that's the gospel going forward. I think that's the part where, when we talk about you know, bless being how we live.
Speaker 1:Begin with prayer, listen to the person's story, eat with them, serve them, share your story of grace. That's got to be over and over and over again with the same people, especially the ones who have invited us into their lives so intimately as your ex-wife has, and she's sort of stuck with it because she know that she can't co-parent singly because she needs you and you're obviously. She keeps calling you because you're an effective something and so there's a reason why she wants you over there. So there's a ask for you to be your inputs asked for. So that means if you went in there and say, hey, I just want to pray for you before you start your day hey, I and she said something wicked off of that. Okay, hey, maybe not, today's not the day and then you say, hey, just want to pray for you before you start. Fine, whatever, just don't make too long. No, now we're moving forward.
Speaker 3:And you don't have to look like you know it all or that you are just some like totally different person now that you're a Christian, you can still be relatable and show what it looks like to learn.
Speaker 1:Do you take your kids to school? Is that part of the process now?
Speaker 2:Now, yeah, I drop Charlotte off and I go with Megan to drop off Brody.
Speaker 1:So what I do with my kids? Austin sometimes rides his bike, but before he rides bike I pray over him before he leaves the house. But for the other now, in the winter, I drive him. So I drive him to school. It's like only like a mile, so it's like not much, but I hold each boy and I pray a blessing over each one about their day and I go. God, I pray for Austin that he would have an incredible day where he learns, he interacts, he shares the gospel, he has hope, he doesn't feel discouraged. In Jesus' name, god, I pray for Jeff that he would feel just the unbelievable amount of your love, that he's a special child of God, that he's got influence to move the kingdom forward, even to school. God, I pray for Titus that he would learn how to read and he would not make it confusing, but you'd make it just this beautiful experience. In Jesus' name, amen, we get pulled up. All right, guys, see you later. Bye dad, bye, love you, love you. Boom, that's it.
Speaker 3:That's the entire car. I just like have tears in my eyes. That was really sweet.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but that's every day. It's very like meaningful.
Speaker 3:I mean, imagine if you did that every day and she saw you praying over her seat, even if you're stumbling through the prayer, like you don't need to sound like a freaking theologian or a pastor or like even if you are stumbling through the prayer and unsure of yourself the entire time you trying and starting. This tradition, even awkwardly, speaks so much into your kids' lives Because they're seeing their dad do something new and good, even if he might suck at it at first because who doesn't suck at something when they first start trying?
Speaker 1:And I think, especially if you even say hey, I'm gonna pray for you, Megan, God, I pray you bless Megan today and just help her have a great day. Jesus' name amen.
Speaker 2:And you get out of the car and be like.
Speaker 3:I'll see you later and she'll be like you know, like she'll be like confused and how you speak about your mom, their mom, in front of them, like the worst thing that kids can hear is their parents bashing each other when they're not around and if you lift them up like, hey, you did a great job at X, y or Z, man, your house is really clean, or your house is, man, it's gorgeous in here.
Speaker 1:Way to go at being so whatever, find something to compliment that you know that she cares about. Or you can even say, hey, you look great. Way to go, you really put yourself together.
Speaker 3:I mean, I'm sure she might get angry about that. Yeah, maybe don't say that you really put yourself together, that's not.
Speaker 1:I don't know Like, I think that I think that she could probably misconstrue that yeah, yeah, okay, yeah, I mean. I don't know you wanna. I guess that's what I would do, because with you know, with your mom, with a parent kid's mom, you wanna tell them how much you love them.
Speaker 3:But yeah, maybe you don't go there, but just you can find something. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, all right man.
Speaker 3:That was a long podcast right there. Yeah, this was fun though.
Speaker 1:Yeah, all right. Hey, listen, thanks for watching. If you got any questions. Well, bre, don't worry, katie's not going anywhere, she's coming back, and if you and machine gun Nick will be back, we can have this conversation. All all, all again. Yeah, I think it'd be awesome.
Speaker 3:Next month we'll have another reevaluation.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we're gonna have a reevaluation next month.
Speaker 2:All right, so make sure you text-. I'm gonna be on so many reevaluations. We're gonna have like just a month of Nick's evaluations.
Speaker 3:How'd this go?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:How'd that go We'll love it, all right.
Speaker 1:Well, anyway, 737-231-0605, text us or go to pastorplekcom. Leave a message for us there. We would love to hear from you. We talk, faith, culture, everything in between. We even get your marriage. Thank you so much for watching. Have an awesome week of worship.